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Good Versus Evil

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  • #46
    Good Versus Evil

    ** This thread discusses the article: Good Versus Evil **
    The political party that is in power today in the USA understands this as history understands this (before history is rewritten). First off, I am not up in arms against my country now or even when the other politcal party was in power. With checks and balances it takes some mighty evil to turn this country into something that will turn the general populace into an armed revolution....which is what happened back in the 1770's, which is why your Queen doesn't have a residence in Wash DC. But, the idea is: when it gets so oppressive....no that's not the idea, the idea is it will never get oppressive like it was in the former USSR (an unarmed populace) with an armed populace like we have had since this country was founded on an armed populace who overthrew tyrants. It is the government who has to keep a certain amount of paranoia about the population. It is the way its designed. Its in the history books, England didn't give us our freedom, and an unarmed population won't keep it. Protection against just plain local criminals is just a side benefit.

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    • #47
      Good Versus Evil

      ** This thread discusses the article: Good Versus Evil **
      I've decided to stop replying about gun and gun control issues, because I think that no matter how much we discuss, in the end we will still disagree. I would, however, like to correct one unrelated thing that Tom said:
      But I think we should focus on what this forum is for: AS/400 COMPUTERS!!!
      Actually, while the vast majority of the forums under the MC Press auspices are there to discuss AS/400 (aka iSeries) issues, this particular forum is attached to the article that I wrote titled "Good versus Evil," which talked about how technology was being used both as a force for great good and great evil in the wake (no pun intended) of the tsunami disaster. This particular forum is a place to discuss the issues raised by that article. As far as I know, the powers that be do not put any limits on the discussions in these forums other than good taste and respect. However, I never expected this forum to turn into a discussion about gun control. I had hoped that there would be a discussion of how we can use technology for good purposes and thwart the evil. As tragic as the tsunami was, I think we should also look beyond the tsunami. I forget the numbers, but I think something like the same number of people who died from the tsunami die every week of AIDS in Africa. That is only one other catastrophe, someone in this thread mentioned a number of other ongoing atrocities that are causing great suffering around the world -- and I agree with the list that was given. And there are more. My point in the article was that, through our choices, technology can be used as a force of good or a force of evil in these situations. My article celebrated the good and lamented the bad. And, to make a short story long, those are the sorts of things that this particular form was set up to discuss. There are hundreds of other forums -- attached to other MC Press articles and in the "Forums" section -- for discussing iSeries issues.

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      • #48
        Good Versus Evil

        ** This thread discusses the article: Good Versus Evil **
        Are guns even a technology? If guns are technology, then everything is a technology, so what would be the point in that case? Technology as a term in the way we use it is short for advanced technology, those things that take advanced skills to manipulate, good or evil. It is often these advanced manipulators, scientists, that we usually are referring to when we ask what controls should be placed on advanced technology. But some just like to trot out their NRA membership like a Pavlovian reflex. And, yes, I'm holding a Kruger with a scope sighted on the screen even as I type. As if you all thought my posts weren't scary enough. rd

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        • #49
          Good Versus Evil

          ** This thread discusses the article: Good Versus Evil **
          Just out of curiosity, who gets to decide when the government is being tyranical and it is OK to overthrow them? Me? You? Somebody else?
          Its in the history books, England didn't give us our freedom, and an unarmed population won't keep it.
          That's true, but Canada achieved its freedom without a revolution. It took almost 100 more years than the US, but Canada is now an independent country, with the Queen as just a figurehead. And Ghandi achieved quite a bit in India through peaceful civil disobedience. I'm not much of a historian, but I suspect that there are other examples of peaceful transitions to freedom. Even if not, is civilization incapable of advancing to a state where we can settle our differences without war or are we forever to be mired in violence? (No, I'm not naive. I don't expect to see a wholly peaceful world in my time. But I can dream, can't I?)

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          • #50
            Good Versus Evil

            ** This thread discusses the article: Good Versus Evil **
            There are no more mongols swooping from the east killing all they see just for the sake of conquest. The Mongols were actually benevolent and enlightened. Sure, they swooped in and ransacked anyone that didn't pay their taxes, but so does the IRS. But seriously, the Mongols allowed their captured territories to keep their own religions and languages and were somewhat enlighted, not savages. They were also highly trained warriors, not savages. Their military maneuvers were studied and copied by advanced western civilizations centuries later. They didn't kill you as long as you didn't resist and paid your taxes. I don't see any difference today. rd

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            • #51
              Good Versus Evil

              ** This thread discusses the article: Good Versus Evil **
              Ok, I didn't get pass History 101. Dreaming is fine, I do a bit of it myself. In my book, it is okay to hate violence, I do. I don't sit around plotting against my country. I sit around playing on my computer, in part because I don't have to sit around doing the other. But, I think chanting 'give peace a chance' in any serious discussion of world politics without owning the biggest gun is an invitation to be dominated tomorrow. Remember how this thread started? Evil people. Without removing or isolating the evil people, they will ply their trade to dominate you and me even if the only technology they have available is their digits.

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              • #52
                Good Versus Evil

                ** This thread discusses the article: Good Versus Evil **
                I needed a break and dropped in to check the forum and it just so happened that the message at the top of the list was the one I read and replied to... without having read your article! But now that I've read your article I couldn't agree more. The aid scams are sick and malacious text messaging is completely depraved. The tsunami and it's devastion is mind boggling. I share your disgust with the scum who exploit the disaster as I think most people do. But accentuate the positive: if not for the incredible communications we have now the world's response would have been much slower, and the loss of life even greater. Technology was used for good. The vast majority of people reflexivly rushed to the aid of their fellow human. Keep on the sunny side.

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                • #53
                  Good Versus Evil

                  ** This thread discusses the article: Good Versus Evil **
                  Joel, I hope you have enjoyed the discussion. I respect your right to respond to whatever you decide to. So no mention of the 'G' word. I am saddened by the tragic events. I am encouraged by the outpouring of help. And I am outraged by the acts of evil people whether their acts were technologically current or not. Hunt them down and hang them by their toenails or continue to be plagued by them. Keep up the tirades. Not only do I like to write from the gut, I enjoy reading the same. I could have been a Canadien.

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                  • #54
                    Good Versus Evil

                    ** This thread discusses the article: Good Versus Evil **
                    Joel, are you by any chance suggesting that the leaders of the American Revolution should NOT have declared independence? You realize of course that if the US had not declared independence, the chances are that there would be no Canada. Instead, there's at least as good a chance that had it not been for the stabilizing effect of the United States, rather than three large, relatively peaceful governments North America would instead have spent a long period of time as a number of small, independent warring colonial nation-states not unlike South America or Africa. As to who gets to decide whether the government is being tyrannical, the answer is simple: the People. If you're unclear on who the People are, then you might want to take an opportunity to read the documents written by those Colonial hotheads (the ones you imply perhaps were unnecessary). I guess they don't teach much about the American Revolution in Canada, but really, they did some pretty good writing back then. There's one really good one called the Declaration of Independence that's one of my favorites; it spells out the concepts quite clearly. We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. --That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, --That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security. Some key phrases: "Consent of the governed" and "destructive to these ends" and "Right of the People". Read through that, and if you have any more questions I'll be happy to go over them with you. One of my favorites is the use of the word "unalienable" rather than "inalienable"; I can spend hours on that concept by itself. You see, I don't take Democracy as a joke; I take it as a gift, a blessing and a serious, serious responsibility. The seed of Democracy is often difficult to nourish, and has proven far too easy to extinguish when uncared for. Historically, Democracy has been watered with blood because those in power will kill to stop it. For every Indian Independence there are unfortunately ten Tienman Squares; for every Ghandi, ten Hitlers; for every Canada, a hundred Civil Wars. Power corrupts, absolute power corrupts absolutely, and until all absolute rulers, from Stalin to Saddam, are replaced by peaceful representative governments, then no, there is no hope for peace. Instead there are only the muffled cries of the oppressed and the guilty silence of those who stand by and do nothing. Joe

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                    • #55
                      Good Versus Evil

                      ** This thread discusses the article: Good Versus Evil **
                      Whoever wins the war is right. British loyalists were wrong. Southerners in the Civil War were wrong. Indians were wrong. Mexicans were wrong. When we want to conquer, we're right. For anyone else, they're wrong. I prefer having other people tell me we're right or asking for our help myself. It's a clearer perspective. The perspective is often clear, others less so but justifiable, others just less so. As such, I'll be looking for people from other countries to tell me when we're right. And I won't be holding my breath. rd

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                      • #56
                        Good Versus Evil

                        ** This thread discusses the article: Good Versus Evil **
                        Whoever wins the war is right. Tripe. Poland was not wrong when Hitler smashed her, nor was Kuwait wrong when Iraq attacked. While there's a certain truth to the idea that history is written by the winners, there is also right and wrong, or as the title is here, Good and Evil. Democracy is Good, Despotism is Evil. If you don't have those moral standards, fine, but don't trivialize the actions of those who do. I prefer having other people tell me we're right or asking for our help myself. It's a clearer perspective. Of COURSE it's easier to be popular. That's sort of the definition of "peer pressure". Do you also decide your personal ethics based on what other people tell you? Are your decisions of right and wrong based on popular opinion? Would you tell your children to ask others for permission before they act? "All it takes for Evil to triumph is for Good men to do nothing." You would do nothing unless asked. Evil dances a jig. Joe

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