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[J.Klebanoff]

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You mean that the world doesn't end beyond the edge of downtown Toronto? Damn! Now I've got to change the very foundations of my thinking.

[H.Boldt]

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Joel: When I read "Starbucks" in your missive, I assumed you had originally written "Tim Hortons" but your editor changed it to something more of your readers would recognize. Comedian Ron James had this to say about Starbucks: "I only go to Starbucks to see what the world would be like if Hitler had won the war!" I could say more, but I think that just about says it all. Cheers! Hans

[J.Klebanoff]

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Nope, there was no editorial change. I'm a loyal Starbucks fan. I know it's considered unpatriotic, but I much prefer Starbucks coffee to Tim Horton's. I just think it tastes better. I like strong coffee. (When I'm in the U.S. and somewhere that has a Peet's outlet, I consider it an equal to Starbucks and I'm happy to give my business to Peet's, but Peet's is not here.) As to the Hitler comment, my parents were born here, but if Hitler had won the war and exported his ideas to North America, I probably wouldn't be here. Come to think of it, Howard Schultz, the chairman and the person who built the humble Seattle coffee store into the powerhouse it is today, probably wouldn't be here either. Therefore, James' comment is insulting and wrong. End of discussion.

[R.Daugherty]

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Starbucks is around the corner both from my apartment in Jacksonville and my job a few miles away. And for the company I worked for in Columbus it was actually in the company building lower level. Tim Horton's is a lot more affordable, though. And better food. They were also all over Columbus after Wendy's bought them. rd

[Guest.Visitor]

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Ofcourse it is unpatriotic to not love Tim Horton. But ofcourse you are a third generation Canadian by birth whereas I am a first generation Canadian by choice. A decade ago when I took oath for my Canada, I pledged my allegiance not only to the Queen, Tim Hortons, and ice hockey, I also pledged my allegiance to practice "aye" and Canadian humor. Well since you atleast practice the last one, I guess I can still certify your patriotism. I stopped drinking coffee when I had a heart palpitation. I consulted the doctor thinking I had a cardiac arrest. He gave me a clean bill of health but told me to stop drinking coffee or any other form of caffeine. Being the patriot Canadian that I am, I ask my elder son who still lives in Canada to bring some Tim Hortons when he comes to pay me a visit. I then drink it once in a while as a patriotic ritual. I also tell him to record "Royal Canadian Air Farce" but it has not happened yet. I tell my younger son, who lives with me, to watch hockey because when he grows up, he will have to go back to Canada.

[J.Klebanoff]

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Hi Hassan, Yes, there are a couple of advantages to being a native born Canadian rather than a Canadian by choice. For example, about six years ago my brother-in-law got his Canadian citizenship and I saw for the first time what, if my memory serves me, was the citizenship oath. As part of it, the holder promised to uphold three core Canadian values. I forget what the first two were. I think they were something like peace and freedom, or words to that effect. But I do remember the third, it was compassion. As a native born Canadian, I didn't have to take the oath, so I'm not bound by it. That means that I can keep my Canadian citizenship without being compassionate. It gives me a kind of freedom that you don't have.

[Guest.Visitor]

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Once a Newfoundlander asked me, "Do you know why we Newfies are such good comedians?". I gave him a long list of socio-econonic-blah-blah reasons including their tradition of good Canadian humor. He shook his head and said, "No, we can get away with whatever we say by saying, 'Hey I am a Newfie, we DO talk stupid things' ". Ron James has this advantage of being a Newfoundlander. He will get away with what he said about Starbucks. So for the Starbucks haters, their website www.ihatestarbucks.com has a whole list of alternates to Starbucks even in the States where there is no Tim Horton. Visit this site when you next plan the trip to South. http://www.ihatestarbucks.com/other_choices.php

[H.Boldt]

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Joel: I think you might have missed one point in my last comment: Ron James, the speaker of that comment on Starbucks, is a comedian. It's the job of a comedian to make people laugh (and sometimes think), and James does a very good job of that. He may not be the most politically correct comedian, and I don't always agree with him, but when he gets into his rants, he is hilariously funny. You can occasionally see him on the Comedy Network. Oh yeah, I forgot. You don't watch television. Ever hear of a television? It's a handy invention. I should show you how it works sometimes! (Adapting a rant by Oscar Leroy, a character on Corner Gas.) ;-) Cheers! Hans

[H.Boldt]

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Hassan: There are a number of very funny people from the province of Newfoundland and Labrador, including Ron James, Rick Mercer, Shaun Majumder, Cathy Jones, and Mary Walsh (to name a few). But as far as I know, none of them has actually said 'Hey I am a Newfie, we DO talk stupid things'. None of this bunch fits the typical east coast hoser stereotype that you might associate with the likes of the Trailer Park Boys. In fact, some, like Rick Mercer, have a more urban, central Canada style of humor. BTW, I don't hate Starbucks. I just don't like the idea of having to learn a whole new vocabulary if I want a simple cup of coffee. But just in case I really need a caffeine fix and the only available place is a Starbucks, how exactly do I order a small black coffee? Cheers! Hans

[tdr_01@yahoo.com]

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I live in a county with a population of 150,000 people and we have two Starbucks. One opened about two years ago in a college bookstore and one opened about two months ago. Neither of these are within walking distance for me. In fact, one of them is really not walkable for anyone. It is located right on a side street near the entrance ramp to a major highway. And who is this Tim Horton anyway?

[J.Klebanoff]

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I'm sure one of my fellow Canadians will want to pipe in on this, but Tim Horton (now deceased) was a hockey star who opened a donut shop. Tim Hortons (it doesn't use an apostrophe in it's name) has expanded its menu to include soups and sandwiches. Tim Hortons is a major Canadian icon. In fact, some Canadians who don't get particularly excited when seeing the Canadian flag or hearing the national anthem, will place their hands over their hearts when they pass a Tim Hortons or even hear the name. That's a bit funny because for about 10 years it was owned by Wendy's, which is an American company. Wendy's recently spun Tim Hortons off as a separate entity (it distributed the last of the shares to Wendy's shareholders just a couple of weeks ago). Tim Hortons trades on both the Toronto and New York stock exchanges, but considering less than 20% of the IPO shares were sold on the open market and the rest were distributed to Wendy's shareholders, I suspect that most of the shares are still not held by Canadians. So the Canadian icon status is a bit ironic. There are a few Tim Hortons in the U.S. It's everywhere in Canada.

[Guest.Visitor]

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Yes I am aware of the tradition of Newfoundland aka "The Rock" in producing quality comedians. Actually there was a documentary on CBC a long time ago about this matter. I wonder if you remember that. I think in the long list, Rick Mercer stands out. Ofcourse none of those comedians said anything like what I quoted, but the joke of my Newfoundlander friend made me think that maybe if Ron James get into trouble, he will bail out by saying this. A very old stale joke. A king got angry with his comedian and ordered his death. The comedian asked for the choice of death in view of the smiles he brought all those years. The king agreed and the comedian chose "death by old age". Comedians get away with whatever they said, and that is my point.

[tdr_01@yahoo.com]

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"Tim Horton (now deceased) was a hockey star who opened a donut shop." "There are a few Tim Hortons in the U.S. It's everywhere in Canada." Hockey and Canada. That probably explains why this American never heard of Tim Horton. Hockey is considered a second-tier sport in the US by most people. (I'm not sure why, given our affinity for rough and tumble sports). Although I think hockey is fun to watch. And we seem to ignore our neighbors to the north. (Again, I'm not sure why. Canada is a good friend to the US. And I find Canada to be a classier version of the US in some respects.)

[J.Klebanoff]

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Hockey is considered a second-tier sport in the US by most people.

I think I can speak on behalf of my fellow Canadians when I say we would be happy to have you come up for a visit. Just a warning if you do: I'm not much of a sports fan myself, so you wouldn't have a problem with me, but there are places in Canada (namely any sports bar during hockey season) where referring to hockey as a second-tier sport would be considered to be fighting words.

[Guest.Visitor]

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Hockey is nothing more than boxing on ice. Don Rickles used to make fun of hockey by calling people "hockey pucks" to insult them. Rickles once said that hockey was only good if you want to eat soup without opening your mouth. Tom. Here are some temperature conversions: 50° Fahrenheit (10° C) • New Yorkers try to turn on the heat. • Canadians plant gardens. 40° Fahrenheit (4.4° C) • Californians shiver uncontrollably. • Canadians Sunbathe. 35° Fahrenheit (1.6° C) • Italian Cars won't start • Canadians drive with the windows down 32° Fahrenheit (0 ° C) • Distilled water freezes • Canadian water get thicker. 0° Fahrenheit (-17.9° C) • New York City landlords finally turn on the heat. • Canadians have the last cookout of the season. -40° Fahrenheit (-40° C) • Hollywood disintegrates. • Canadians rent some videos. -60° Fahrenheit (-51° C) • Mt. St. Helens freezes. • Canadian Girl Guides sell cookies door-to-door. -100° Fahrenheit (-73° C) • Santa Claus abandons the North Pole. • Canadians pull down their ear flaps. -173° Fahrenheit (-114° C) • Ethyl alcohol Freezes. • Canadians get frustrated when they can't thaw the keg. -460° Fahrenheit (-273° C) • Absolute zero; all atomic motion stops. • Canadians start saying "cold, eh?" -500° Fahrenheit (-295° C) • Hell freezes over. • The Toronto Maple Leafs win the Stanley Cup.