Outsoursing

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Outsoursing

Joe Pluta wrote: > Now I remember why I don't actually bother trying to converse with > you. I was wondering why you had tried again. I was reminded when he tried to sell the line that programmers were getting $120k in So Cal. Bill

[Guest.Visitor]

Outsoursing

Glen wrote: Let's factor in a very big issue. The communication issue. I've worked in a lot of different organizations and when everybody spoke the same language and similar accents there were problems with the users communicating what they needed. It usually took me going to their desk and having them show me what they were doing and then explaining what they wanted to do. How does this type of communication exist with outsourcing to another country? Yes, I've been on both sides of the fence, been part of an outsource company and been an employee that the company went to outsourcing. I can tell you that when I worked for a Consultant company and we had a contract to be the programmers we were on site, not thousands of miles away. We had direct personal contact with the users. This is how the understanding of what a project is supposed to do comes from Yes, it is correct. The communication is a huge factor in a project development, especially when the development team is miles away from the users. However, I think, the investors/owners would push IT managers to outsource part of the projects. I guess, we all know why. The question is, are the IT managers ready for this kind of development. Probably not. In addition, they do not have time, expirience, and patience for this. Of course, it is more productive and manageable to use the in-house team. I think, they would need to hire another manager who could communicate both parties. Of course, this person should have not only technical skills; he must know the language and be a great communicator. Probably he/she would be required to travel overseas. I am sure there are many smart people who could create a model to manage such as task.

[Guest.Visitor]

Outsoursing

ELISSA DVORAK and 20 other M.B.A. students from Indiana University's Kelley School of Business decided to spend spring break this year traveling around India. But the trip was not meant to be a vacation. Under the auspices of the M.B.A. program, Ms. Dvorak and her classmates spent 10 days learning about outsourcing from local and international companies in cities like Bangalore, New Delhi and Mumbai. "Outsourcing is a subject we need to know about if we want to be competitive in the future," said Ms. Dvorak, 29, who is in her second year of graduate school. Outsourcing has become a prime subject for business students. Thousands of white-collar jobs are moving overseas every year, and at least 3.3 million jobs in service industries, accounting for $136 billion in wages, will leave the United States by 2015 for lower-cost countries, according to Forrester Research. "It's not something you can ignore," said Ms. Dvorak, who had just finished an eight-week course in outsourcing that she was required to take before the trip. Other business schools besides Indiana are offering courses or other instruction in offshore outsourcing, and students are signing up in an effort to add to their managerial tool kits. "You hear about outsourcing all the time these days," said Amir Nahai, 26, a first-year student at the Tuck School of Business at Dartmouth. "But you don't really know what the advantages and disadvantages are." Tuck does not offer a course in outsourcing, but it provides the opportunity for overseas exposure to the subject. Over his midterm break, Mr. Nahai traveled to China, South Korea and Japan on a tour sponsored by the school and called the Tuck Global Consultancy. The program focuses on foreign business logistics, ethics, global citizenship and supply-chain management. Interest in outsourcing "is really booming," said Joseph A. Massey, director of the Center for International Business at Tuck. Since the inception of the consultancy program six years ago, the number of participating students has grown to 70 from 19. Some 30 percent of Dartmouth's M.B.A. class of 2003 completed internships or did work overseas before graduation, an increase of about 5 percent over 2002 and 10 percent over 2001. Other M.B.A. programs, like those at Cornell, Stanford and Bentley College, also offer looks at offshore outsourcing. Bentley, in Waltham, Mass., just began a course called "I.T. Offshoring," to be followed by a 14-day trip to India. "India is a leader in terms of services provided - about $6 billion worth," said Donald Chand, a Bentley professor of computer information systems, who taught the class. "And it's an English-speaking country. The opportunity to continue to expand there will be a big issue for the next generation of managers." At the Massachusetts Institute of Technology's Sloan School of Management, two business professors, Amar Gupta and Lester C. Thurow, have added a course called "Offshoring" to the spring curriculum. The class, devoted to the subject of sending jobs overseas, reached its 70-student limit within 24 hours of opening for enrollment. The first day, students squeezed in to hear the two professors talk about how outsourcing works strategically, culturally and organizationally. A few students from Harvard Business School also slipped in to get in on the conversation. "We don't have a class like this," said Pankaj Soni, 29, a second-year M.B.A. student at Harvard. "And from a professional standpoint, it's of enormous value." IT'S a hot topic," said Professor Gupta, pointing out that in some cases, M.B.A. students go overseas themselves, "to China, to India, wherever, and they'll need to be able to manage operations irrespective of where they're posted." Last year, Professor Gupta began leading a trip to India lasting a week and a half. In addition to visiting domestic and multinational companies in India, students met with financial policy makers and dined with the president, Abdul Kalam. That trip was preceded by a different course, "Special Studies in Management: India," for 20 students. (Seventy students had tried to sign up, Professor Gupta said.) The trip was meant to help students understand not only outsourcing but also the cultural aspects of overseas work, he said. Anita Khosla, 27, a first-year student at Sloan, is among the students in Professor Gupta's course this semester. This month, she went with the class to India, where her parents were born. "There's no book where you can read about this," she said. "There's no history. It's happening right now. And as students, we're a part of the next big thing." Timely topics have caused explosions of interest at business schools before. In the late 1990's, courses in entrepreneurship and electronic commerce proliferated. "When e-commerce became a fad, people were talking about strange business models; they didn't have the competence to teach these classes and took the syllabi off the Web," said Ravi Aron, assistant professor of operations and information management at the Wharton School of the University of Pennsylvania. Today, he said, most schools are not prepared to teach outsourcing. "It's still very new," he said. Wharton and several other top business schools, including the University of Chicago Graduate School of Business and the Stern School of Business at New York University, say they address outsourcing when necessary in classes about international economics. "The issue of offshoring is of great interest to students," said Thomas F. Cooley, dean of Stern. "But it's only the latest issue in a long movement to a more global economy." But Professor Gupta predicted that student enthusiasm for outsourcing classes would grow as the global market expanded, and that more business schools would start courses in the subject. "It's definitely more than a passing fad," he said. "It's not something that's going to be talked about for only one or two years. We'll still be studying this carefully for a very long time."

[GlenKerner]

Outsoursing

Great, so our colleges are now teaching our "next generation managers" how to outsource and take jobs away from us. That is the point of the article. What is the point anymore, when our own colleges start teaching how to outsource we all might as well move to India. It seems you are taking a lot of time trying to find articles that are telling us I.T. professionals that we are going to loose our jobs because you (and Indian) will be taking the job from us. Does this make you proud? Or do you just like to stir up trouble? I am an American, and I am a HIGHLY skilled I.T. Professional. I demand as a citizen of the USA the right to work in the country of my birth. I demand that U.S. companies stop hiring cheap, unskilled, Non-residential labor. I got it. Why don't we all do what the Auto workers eventually did to protect their jobs. Form a Union. Just kidding. I understand outsourcing to 3rd world countries is a reality. We all know this. But to have someone be so arrogant as to try and rub it in our faces it not only non-professional but just simply in bad taste. Personally, if you ever came across my desk as a potential hiree (or outsource company) I wouldn't hire you just for that fact. You are not better, and I suspect technical wise you are not even close to my equal, than anybody here. You are currently on the recieving end of something that will make you lots of money. That is wonderful for you. But your attitude stinks. Yes I do take it personally when someone is constantly trying to rub my nose in the fact that I might be replace by some cheap, unskilled, outsourced programmer living in another country. I always have lived with the fact that I can be replaced by the programmer next door, if the price was right, that is the nature of the business. So please get off your HIGH horse and get a life. Time to move on.

[David Abramowitz]

Outsoursing

I wonder what Indian companies do if their IT costs are too high? hmmmmmmmm. Dave

[dacust]

Outsoursing

David said: "I wonder what Indian companies do if their IT costs are too high?" Actually, there are already reports of Indian companies oursourcing projects to China. The IT industry in India may be short-lived indeed. -dan (Sorry, I just HAD to correct the mis-spelling in the title.)

[Guest.Visitor]

Outsoursing

Hi All, I am an indian it worker. I read many articles in this forum and it looks like many americans are scared of outsoursing it jobs. I understand them, however, it the america is all about TO MAKE PROFITS. Outsoursing just one chanel of profiting. In additin, many american it worker make even more money by outsoursing. They became as brokers beetwen the american company and the lower paid it work outside usa. Of course, they need more skills then just codding. We outsource the it or any work to. We find less payng worker in India or China. Thats where the money is made nowadays. Some people enjoy it more then just seat and codding. The bottom line , dont be discarriage, there are lots of opportunities. And , i think, its easier for you americans guys to found projects then for us.The real money just start to take of. Thanks

[Guest.Visitor]

Outsoursing

NOW that is a question worth weighing in on....! Use Pakistani labor of course!!!!! (that's a joke.) For those who do not know this, the Indians hate the Pakistani more that the Middle Eastern Muslims hate us! At least that is what our trust worthy news services tell us! Hum, Indians outsourcing to China. Wow, Next thing you will see is the Chinese contracting the OUTSOURCED/DOWNSIZED American workers who are willing (due to unemployment) to work for less than the Indians and the Chinese. Talk about the "cheapening of IT professional services" coming true!!!!!