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Interviewing AS/400 Candidates like the NAZI's did.

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  • #16
    Interviewing AS/400 Candidates like the NAZI's did.

    David,
    The problem with probing personalities, is that an individual's personality will always be relative to your own. What constitutes a "poor" personality will be relative to the personality of the person sitting in judgement.
    Of course, since the individual would work for ME then a personality match is very important.
    chuck
    Opinions expressed are not necessarily those of my employer.

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    • #17
      Interviewing AS/400 Candidates like the NAZI's did.

      David, I think it's very important, in an interview, to put the applicant in an antagonistic environment. I want to see how they handle stress and pressure "on the spot" and an interview is a particularly good place to do that. The personality of the candidate is much more important to me than their skills, since it's something I can't mold or change. There are a number of very good techniques to have a candidate reveal things about their personalities. The proof is in the pudding, in the 26 years I've been in management and hiring programmers, only one that I've hired has ever left voluntarily. And, none that I've hired have I had to terminate for cause. You can check out my article in News/400 (about 5-6 years ago) regarding hiring the right people. chuck Opinions expressed are not necessarily those of my employer. "David Abramowitz" wrote in message news:1e94f3b7.12@WebX.WawyahGHajS... > The problem with probing personalities, is that an individual's personality will always be relative to your own. What constitutes a "poor" personality will be relative to the personality of the person sitting in judgement. > > This is a grey area, as people tend to be prejudiced. Did you know that you have (statistically) a better chance of getting a position, if the person doing the hiring is the same height and weight as you? As an independent, I go on more interviews than most. There are times I've felt that I've blown an interview, only to win a contract. The opposite has also been true. > > > Unless the individual on the other side of the desk spends the allotted time picking his nose, or anything blatantly obnoxious, I might think that personality judgement on a single interview might be hasty. I, for one, would hate to lose a good individual because of initial non-technical impressions. > > > Dave > >

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      • #18
        Interviewing AS/400 Candidates like the NAZI's did.

        Susan, I, too, give a test when a person first arrives for an interview. It's not a daunting test, but generally takes 20-30 minutes to complete. I've had people turn around and walk out when they find out they must take a test. Frankly, I want those individuals to leave. It saves my time and theirs. chuck Opinions expressed are not necessarily those of my employer. "Susan Behrens" wrote in message news:1e94f3b7.13@WebX.WawyahGHajS... > Dave wrote: "The problem with probing personalities, is that an individual's personality will always be relative to your own. What constitutes a "poor" personality will be relative to the personality of the person sitting in judgement." > > What we were talking about (at least I was) is about people reacting badly to a stressful situation. My employer experienced candidates sneaking out without a word just as John did. That sort of person probably will not do well under stress. The same can be said for someone who gets really angry at the test. My employer was looking for someone to make reasonable progress on the test, while retaining a good attitude towards it. This is not the same as making assumptions about temperment based on height, weight, or anything else. These tests enable the interviewer to make assumptions about a candidate's behavior based on their behavior. I don't see too many "good individuals" losing from this interviewing technique. > >

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        • #19
          Interviewing AS/400 Candidates like the NAZI's did.

          Chuck, You have piqued my curiosity. Please give an example of what you mean by "antagonistic". Joe

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          • #20
            Interviewing AS/400 Candidates like the NAZI's did.

            Joe, There are a number of things you can do to get them into an unfavorable environment. Ask leading questions such as: "Tell me about your worst day ever." And then push them for details. Propose a very difficult situation and ask them to compose a result or response on the fly. Push them hard for details and don't let them be wishy-washy. Push the discussion into an area that you feel will make them uncomfortable and pursue it. However, never let the subject linger there. Once you've seen what you want to see move to a favorable environment. Otherwise you'll leave a bad taste in their mouth. I could go on and on about interviews, but they generally break down into 3 sections. 1. Have the candidate disclose as much as they can about themselves _before_ you reveal anything about the company or the position. You should, as the interviewer, do as little talking as possible. I've had candidates talk for 30 minutes before I've asked anything. Often, if you don't try to fill awkward silences, they'll ramble on revealing things they didn't mean to reveal. 2. Ask lots of questions to determine the personality of the person. Then go into their experiences. 3. Sell the position and the company. This is an important part of the wrap-up. Even if the candidate isn't your #1 pick you want them to REALLY want to work there. You want them to feel excited about the company and the job. They should feel like they are a top candidate. Unless there's no chance for them to get the job, keep them excited. If, OTOH, they have no shot at it, you should tell them in the first interview. Don't put that off. Never skimp on time. Allot 90-120 minutes for an interview. You have to live with this person a long time, give them a shot. And, have another manager (a peer) who knows good interviewing techniques interview them on a different day (candidates have good and bad days) and immediately compare notes. This helps temper your thoughts about the candidate. And, above all, take notes during and after the interview. Otherwise, the candidates all run together. chuck Opinions expressed are not necessarily those of my employer. "Joe Wells" wrote in message news:1e94f3b7.18@WebX.WawyahGHajS... > Chuck, > > You have piqued my curiosity. Please give an example of what you mean by "antagonistic". > > > Joe > >

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            • #21
              Interviewing AS/400 Candidates like the NAZI's did.

              Chuck Ackerman wrote: I think it's very important, in an interview, to put the applicant in an antagonistic environment. When I get a call to interview for a company, it is generally because that company wants my services. If during the process of the interview anything appears to break that premise, I may decline to offer my services. I suspect that despite your statement of success (which if I understand correctly says that are still working with the same people you hired 20 or more years ago) that you have lost people; good people during the interview process. I applaud an individual who has found a technique that is satisfactory to him for successfully completing a task, but I would not recommend this to others. Dave

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              • #22
                Interviewing AS/400 Candidates like the NAZI's did.

                I concur David. If I was being interviewed in such a way I would walk out. After all, what type of environment would you have _after_ you got the job if the interview was conducted this way. I would assume there would be better places to work... Terry

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                • #23
                  Interviewing AS/400 Candidates like the NAZI's did.

                  Chuck, Thank you for responding. My initial reaction to your post was that if I felt I was being antagonized during an interview, I would leave and never look back - I have enough self confidence to know that I do not have to work in an environment like that. However, your second post altered this initial reaction somewhat. I do not think I would have a problem being interviewed in such a manner , but it would all depend upon how the interviewer presented him/herself (and if it was a "good" or "bad" day for me!). At any rate, if you and your employees are happy, that is all that matters right? Joe

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                  • #24
                    Interviewing AS/400 Candidates like the NAZI's did.

                    Boy, I opened a can of worms. Please remember, tests are designed for specific purposes. My purpose was to see how a candidate for a consulting position handled the 'impossible' assignment. A person that left the test without any attempt or discussion is not a person that can handle a customer when they say 'I want a new system developed by Friday.' As far as asking a candidate to share their experiences, we know that we all pick our shiniest example to bring out in an interview. As for the headhunter, it is possible that if a headhunter understood about the test they could prep a candidate, but how would they find out it was a stress test and not a technical test? John

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                    • #25
                      Interviewing AS/400 Candidates like the NAZI's did.

                      Terry, As a general rule, most candidates don't realize it's even happening. Those who understand the process generally work fine in the interview. However, some are obsessive about controlling the interview and will, as a general rule, be obsessive about control in general. These people are not good team players and I want to find this out in the interview process. They are best left behind. A programming staff is NOT a place for control freaks or non-team players. Those guys often end up as independent contractors working out of their home. That may be fine for them, but I want a team. Notice my use of "as a general rule." All rules have their exceptions. Also, don't get me wrong, working from home is not bad, however a subset of home workers are those that can't work in an office team environment. They're better off being entrapaneurs. I've been around business, and sports, long enough that teamwork is MUCH more important than high skills. There are occasions, however, that high talent is needed for short spurts and that's what outsourcing is for. I learned this early in my career. chuck Opinions expressed are not necessarily those of my employer. "Terry Winchester" wrote in message news:1e94f3b7.21@WebX.WawyahGHajS... > I concur David. > > If I was being interviewed in such a way I would walk out. > After all, what type of environment would you have _after_ > you got the job if the interview was conducted this way. > > > I would assume there would be better places to work... > > > Terry > >

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                      • #26
                        Interviewing AS/400 Candidates like the NAZI's did.

                        David,
                        I suspect that despite your statement of success (which if I understand correctly says that are still working with the same people you hired 20 or more years ago) that you have lost people; good people during the interview process.
                        Yes and yes. I suspect that there were good people that may have not wanted to work with me. However, I can honestly say that I've never had a candidate refuse an offer from me.
                        Also, there have been two extremely talented programmers that have worked with me for 15 years and have followed me to different employers. I'm new at my current employer and, when the time is right, hope to have them work with me again.
                        chuck
                        Opinions expressed are not necessarily those of my employer.

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Interviewing AS/400 Candidates like the NAZI's did.

                          Chuck, Personally, I have had only a few interviews in my life - none of which I "controlled" in any respect. Nor would I want to control an interview. But, I am intelligent enough to know when people are attempting to play psychological games with me to ascertain my reactions and I will not tolerate that. They will either accept me for my skill level, attitude and personality -or- I leave. BTDT. I feel these attributes are important in having a teamwork ethic. Apparently the company I work for thought the same when they hired me But, as Dennis Miller would say: "...I could be wrong" ;-) Terry

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                          • #28
                            Interviewing AS/400 Candidates like the NAZI's did.

                            A stress test can work the other way, too. I am not an easy candidate to interview. I look for smart, loyal, hard-working, respectful employers; for those who don't shirk from, "Show me, don't tell me".

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                            • #29
                              Interviewing AS/400 Candidates like the NAZI's did.

                              Please remember, tests are designed for specific purposes. My purpose was to see how a candidate for a consulting position handled the 'impossible' assignment. A person that left the test without any attempt or discussion is not a person that can handle a customer when they say 'I want a new system developed by Friday.'

                              Oh, I understand the purpose of the test, my only point was that you are testing the prospect's reaction to your "authority", not a customer's.

                              As far as asking a candidate to share their experiences, we know that we all pick our shiniest example to bring out in an interview.

                              But that's the entire point of the process, if they have one experience that's too good, ask for one where it didn't go very well. If they are not being forthright, you take that into consideration when making a decision. The point is to get the candidate to relate actual experiences and not to answer the proverbial "What are your weaknesses?".

                              As for the headhunter, it is possible that if a headhunter understood about the test they could prep a candidate, but how would they find out it was a stress test and not a technical test?

                              Via a prior candidate.

                              Bill

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                              • #30
                                Interviewing AS/400 Candidates like the NAZI's did.

                                Those who have studied logic, know the difference between a dilemma and a paradox. I was asked at an interview what I would do in a certain situation. After 15 seconds, I realized the situation was a paradox, said so, and was willing to prove out to it. All it did was piss off the interviewer, who thought he was so clever offering up a paradox to see how I would react. Others in the room told me I was the first to figure it out, and made an offer. Fortunately, I had other offers. Dave

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