H-1B Visa Cap Met

[David Abramowitz]

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You missed the point. Anyone consulting 20 years ago, and keeping up with the latest skills, would be earning less today due to over saturation. Given a choice between a known quality at price x, and an unknown quality at x divided by 2 plus 10%, corporate America will more times than not choose the latter. Dave

[Guest.Visitor]

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It may be cheaper to fill the low end of programing professionals with foreign workers, but where will the high end of the programing professionals get their experience; and where will this leave our country in the future.

[ntpunzo@aol.com]

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Number ONE Business will 99.99% of the time go with the cheapest way to get something done. Plenty of people were bothered when manufacturing jobs went to China. And now it is the reluctantly accepted norm. That doesn't make it right. I for one remember when this happened & don't want it to happen to me as an IT professional. Also if this wasn't such a big deal you wouldn't be complaining about it so much. And you have got to be kidding me with not being able to find IT professionals from the existing pool of talent. The lack of IT positions has caused many IT professional to change careers. Take a look at the Sunday Want ads of any major newspaper. The IT section is maybe 1 1/2 pages, compare that to 10 years ago. Where did all the jobs go? Don't tell me the DOTCOM fall caused it. No, a large number were never created because as I said businesses decided to get more out of less, and because many positions went overseas AND because the positions that were available went to the cheapest applicant. And weather or not you want to admit it many of these were to foreigners. Again I don't blame these people, they are just trying to make a living same as me, but again I don't have to like it, But please don't tell me that this isn't a big issue.

[thomasbishop@yahoo.com]

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they told the displaced workers to learn computers and some did, I remember sitting in programming classes with them in college. Now what are they being told to learn?

[David Abramowitz]

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They are told to keep their skills current, or learn newer skills. While having these skills is always a good thing, it just leads to further frustration, as the jobs for newer skills are also going to cheaper labor. Dave

[Guest.Visitor]

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David said, "While having these skills is always a good thing, it just leads to further frustration, as the jobs for newer skills are also going to cheaper labor." This is really the bottom line. Since foreign workers do not compete on a level playing field with US workers, they can provide services at a much lower cost. As long as there is a perception of lower costs, the work will go to the cheaper labor pool - many times productivity will not even matter or be considered! Hooray for the "new global economy" (not)!

[dbogle@socal.rr.com]

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Large organizations like IBM and Microsoft are now using L-1 visas in preference to H-1B visas to lower the cost of employing highly trained individuals in the United States. Department of State statistics show that the use of L-1 visas has increased substantially since fiscal year 1998. That is such a true statement. They are using these to take jobs from US citizens for cheaper offshore payroll. At this time my company has sold their IT department to another US based company who is taking the entire IT department to India. We are now having to train these "highly talented" individuals so that they can do our jobs for less money. At no time was anyone asked to take a cut in pay to help off set the expense, the only option we were given is to train these people and look for a job. Higher profit is the bottom line. From my experience that highly talented pool of offshore people are getting that way by having highly talented US citizens train them. There will be over 200 "highly skilled" individuals out of work in the next 6 to 9 months, due to the hiring of offshore people. The thought that anyone can do our jobs with the right training and they can be done at any location leads me to ask, Why not train the homeless to do our jobs? I bet they would do it for less and there wouldn't be any need for visas. Should be interesting to see what kind of jobs are available in the next 5 years for US IT professionals.

[David Abramowitz]

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When discussing L-1 visas with pols, I find it helpful to discuss purpose and intent. The original frame of L-1 was to allow corporations to bring over executives without a great deal of rigamarole. This is still useful. Imagine a Japanese company trying to build a plant in the U.S. not being able to bring over a supervisor for at least a limited period of time. Once the positive intent has been covered, it is easier to point out the negative abuses. The fact that domestic companies are doing foreign hiring for the sole purpose of usurping U.S. citizen's employment is insidious. I also found it helpful not to advocate the elimination of L-1, but rather a proper and rational reform. For instance writing to your representative for a one-year period of employment before allowing L-1 is reasonable and proper, and may actually get the support of your rep. Unless the rep is pre-disposed to a complete abolition of L-1, advocating such a stance will not be helpful. Dave

[dbogle@socal.rr.com]

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I really wish it were insidious!

[Guest.Visitor]

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Outsourcing, or rather offshoring, is what I'm referring to. Here in the UK there is employment law that prevents an employer from making an employee redundant, and then hiring someone else to do the same job. However, you can make an entire department redundant and outsource the work to another company. I've been bitching and moaning about outsourcing for years, and none of my colleagues listened to me. Then one of the big banks shifted 2,000 jobs to Bangalore and some people started to agree with me but still thought if they kept their heads down then it wouldn't touch them. Now, with the weakening of the pound and the relative stall in economic growth, just about every programmer I know (I was an RPG Lecturer so I know a few) is being facing the threat of their department getting axed. The thing is, there's a whole lot of money to be made/saved by some big and powerful companies on both sides of the pond. Guess who the politicians will end up supporting when WE start rallying for a change in the rules? Just my 2 pence worth. Matt