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Weaving WebSphere: WebSphere Express and Tomcat

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  • J.Pluta
    replied
    Weaving WebSphere: WebSphere Express and Tomcat

    ** This thread discusses the article: Weaving WebSphere: WebSphere Express and Tomcat **
    It's probably because I'm frustrated by the same issues, David. Your points are perfectly valid. It's just that I don't see you offering up anything that we can do about it. And at that point, it's like cursing the weather - certainly valid, but somewhat pointless. As to productive efforts and fruit elsewhere, if you don't say it, then how am I to know? All I see is the complaint, month after month. It's not unlike hearing someone who shall remain nameless going on and on about the MOVE instruction... >grin< Joe

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  • David Abramowitz
    replied
    Weaving WebSphere: WebSphere Express and Tomcat

    ** This thread discusses the article: Weaving WebSphere: WebSphere Express and Tomcat **
    Joe Pluta wrote: So what do you hope to gain by saying it yet again? Wouldn't your time be better spent doing something positive? 1.) - Fair question - I'm venting. 2.) - The purpose of the fora is to exhange ideas, information, and opinions. That is what I am doing. My time participating in these fora is minimal. What would make you think that productive efforts have not produced fruit elsewhere? Dave

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  • J.Pluta
    replied
    Weaving WebSphere: WebSphere Express and Tomcat

    ** This thread discusses the article: Weaving WebSphere: WebSphere Express and Tomcat **
    You can complain, or you can do something about it. How about putting together a website that portrays the strengths of the iSeries? Or going to Java sites and talking about the iSeries? Or maybe creating some web applications that run on an iSeries and publicizing them? You've said this same thing over and over for years now, David. IBM hasn't changed their position. So what do you hope to gain by saying it yet again? Wouldn't your time be better spent doing something positive? I understand your frustration, believe me, but I too am frustrated: frustrated that you find time to complain but not time to do something about it. That seems to be a fairly prevalent attitude in our industry: "IBM needs to fix this." Well, they're not fixing it, so it's up to us. Joe

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  • David Abramowitz
    replied
    Weaving WebSphere: WebSphere Express and Tomcat

    ** This thread discusses the article: Weaving WebSphere: WebSphere Express and Tomcat **
    Joe Pluta wrote: It's really up to us out in the field to convince our customers of the value of the machine. It may be pragmatic, but it's also a shame. I should not have to argue the point when faced with those who would like to change the platform. The prevailing perception is that we work on a system that is antiquated. Perception is more important than reality, and reality is important! Dave

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  • J.Pluta
    replied
    Weaving WebSphere: WebSphere Express and Tomcat

    ** This thread discusses the article: Weaving WebSphere: WebSphere Express and Tomcat **
    Joe, you've got yourself a quandary. It's hard to get started, because nobody really has a road map to get to the web, which is what we need. I think IBM has tried a couple of times, but they get all bollixed up in EJB and J2EE and all that happy horsehockey. What we need is a couple of simple, straightforward examples of how to get an existing application to the web, how to write a new application for the web, and how to integrate the two. The problem is trying to choose the correct technology. Do we write everything in RPG-CGI? Do we use JSP Model II and Struts? Do we use VB.NET? Personally, I think we need to develop those road maps using various technologies, including embedded SQL, service programs, JDBC, PCML, and so on. I would concentrate on iSeries-centric architectures, in which all the business logic is on the iSeries, but I would have several ways of getting data to the outside world. If we were able to build, say, half a dozen different example applications thata showcased various technologies, we could then release them into the field, along with a sort of "expert system" that would ask questions and then point you at an appropriate model. Now, can any of this be done? Yes. Will it? I don't know. Who has the time to build all of thse wonderful things for free? I sure don't. So maybe a small consortium could get together to create a subset of this - one application, one technology, with a nice roadmap. And then add more as time goes on - a sort of open repository of application frameworks. Warning: They tried this once with the San Francisco project, and it failed pretty miserably. I don't know what we can do to try to ensure better success on a project like this. Joe

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  • J.Pluta
    replied
    Weaving WebSphere: WebSphere Express and Tomcat

    ** This thread discusses the article: Weaving WebSphere: WebSphere Express and Tomcat **
    It could mean: 1. Microsoft is desperate to get business, while IBM knows it doesn't have to worry. -or- 2. Microsoft is marketing-driven, while IBM is product-driven. -or- 3. The iSeries gets the shaft once again . I have heard it said that IBM will NEVER market the iSeries name on television. It's just not going to be done. And in general, the iSeries gets short shrift. It's really up to us out in the field to convince our customers of the value of the machine. Is that right? No. Is it the case? Yes. Apply the Serenity Prayer: God, grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, the courage to change the things I can, and the wisdom to know the difference. And in this case, applying that means acknowledging that IBM ain't gonna sell the box, so I have to. Joe

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  • David Abramowitz
    replied
    Weaving WebSphere: WebSphere Express and Tomcat

    ** This thread discusses the article: Weaving WebSphere: WebSphere Express and Tomcat **
    Not a month goes by that a Microsoft saleman doesn't call wanting us to abandon ship and go .NET. No IBM sales people ever call and ask what they can do for us. Such a small sentence speaks volumes on the current state of affairs. Dave

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  • joe@tscusers.org
    replied
    Weaving WebSphere: WebSphere Express and Tomcat

    ** This thread discusses the article: Weaving WebSphere: WebSphere Express and Tomcat **
    Joe: We have standalone Tomcat, HTTP Apache/Tomcat and now Express running on our Model 270 at V5R2. We sell our software and also run a small ASP shop. The ASP customers are on HTTP Apache/Tomcat, our outside customers are mostly on V5R1 or V5R2 HTTP Apache/Tomcat and a few are on standalone. One customer is currently trying to change over to Express. Our observation so far is no improvement in speed with Express. All 3 products run at acceptible speed and all 3 are about the same, at least in our current production environment. We are old RPGers also. We began rewritting our applications using JSP/Servlet technology believe it or not in 1998! We continue to use VAJ and Dreamweaver as our development environment for many of the reasons you have previously covered in your articles and one that you cover in this article; Memory size and MS/OS system requirements for WDSCI, lack of a repository in WDSCI and net change capability. We do have WDSCI running on a couple of our PCs but it runs too slow for productivity purposes. The handwriting is on the wall as you say, we have to change. It's just hard to do because we consider ourselves to be application specialists in a very tight vertical market. The web server we use is just sort of a requirement like an operating system and we don't need to understand it after it is initially installed. I finally had a little time this weekend to review some of the recent MC Press surveys. It was a little depressing to see how few iSeries shops are really making any progress with any of the above, i.e. Java development, deployment in a browser, and "green screen forever" mentality. Not a month goes by that a Microsoft saleman doesn't call wanting us to abandon ship and go .NET. No IBM sales people ever call and ask what they can do for us. How can we help spread the word? It is in all of our best interests to help each other convert iSeries applications to the modern world or we will be working for Bill in the near future! Joe Whittle Trust Service Company, Inc.

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  • Weaving WebSphere: WebSphere Express and Tomcat

    ** This thread discusses the article: Weaving WebSphere: WebSphere Express and Tomcat **
    ** This thread discusses the Content article: Weaving WebSphere: WebSphere Express and Tomcat **
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