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IBM should be and will be held to the same standards as M$. Are there any third party tools for the AS/400 that will be replaced with built in features of V5R1? ASC systems management software? Could someone elaborate on that and the 5.1 replacement functionality? To do justice to the injustices that M$ has unleashed on the software industry would require a good deal of time and a different forum. The methods they've used to destroy software companies are a great deal more than bundling free replacements in the OS. In fact, probably as you mentioned only Stac and Netscape were dealt with that way. They're so greedy they only give stuff away as a last resort. Ralph
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Where do you stand? Are you consistant?
The one big tool that comes for free with V5R1 is Visual Age for RPG. This will certainly put a crimp in ASNA's Visual RPG product, and is slightly reminiscent of MS offering IE for free which started the Netscape lawsuit. Webfacing is free, but I don't believe that this is as sophisticated as the JWalk or LANSA products, and thus should not be compared in this fashion. Dave -
Where do you stand? Are you consistant?
IBM made a great move here. It was best for them and the majority of us as well. I can say I feel alot better for the future of RPG as a result of this move and look forward to using VA-RPG and VA-JAVA under a common umbrella. You will almost never find a change that pleases everyone.Comment
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Where do you stand? Are you consistant?
ASNA is now as much about writing programs that work on NT as well as the AS/400, providing for solid, record level business logic against either DB2/400 or their own NT DB2/400 clone. I've heard it suggested many times here that VARPG should be able to run against DB2 on any platform. ASNA is just a lot smarter, a lot more nimble, and a lot more technically advanced than IBM's New Yawk marketing fools who make these kind of decisions. Thus development of software for the AS/400 has come to a screeching halt, unless something's going on that I'm not aware of, while Windows development screams ahead, reducing IBM to trying to get a port here or there of someone's C code from Windows and Unix to run on the AS/400. Then they tell us, look, new AS/400 software. As of last week, M$ is advertising Great Plains in ways that IBM could never hope to be able to accomplish in their wildest marketing dreams, and the press has all of a sudden included M$ Great Plains in the standard list of ERP's along with Oracle, SAP, PeopleSoft,and JDE OneWorld. I guess they're going to replace Baan on that frequently repeated list with Great Plains now. That's not Linux nor the AS/400. It's Windows. You don't hear every other "proprietary" OS vendor saying their product is dead and Linux will replace it. No, they've ported visual interfaces to their OS and are betting their companies that they have unique value to add to their operating system products. Oh, and anything IBM has for the AS/400 runs on their operating systems as well, but very little software that people are buying runs on the "open" AS/400. Yep, we're screwed, blued, and tattooed. RalphComment
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Where do you stand? Are you consistant?
Actually I have no issues with MicroSoft. I like to use the M$ just because I too, would one day like to have more money than the federal trade deficit, gross domestic product value all rolled into one.
I admire Gates, in all honesty. He built this platform, he marketed it, he made it by hard work. Admittedly, he did not do it all. His staff and co-creators are what made his a great product. I like windows, I will continue to use windows and NT. I don't care that a free product like Internet Explorer is written with proprietary coding. It's his, afterall. If NetScape want's to whine, let them come up with a better product. Afterall, Coca Cola and Pepsi won't give me their recipies, just because I want to make a new soda and theirs is the better tasting/selling one. -bret
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Where do you stand? Are you consistant?
Bret wrote: "Afterall, Coca Cola and Pepsi won't give me their recipies, just because I want to make a new soda and theirs is the better tasting/selling one." But what if Coca Cola said. "Here, Coke is free now." Until Pepsi is out of business. That's what Microsoft did. That's what monopolies (desktop opersting systems) are able to do, and that's why they're illegal. You can say, "Aren't we smart? We get free browsers." But there's no free lunch. RalphComment
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Where do you stand? Are you consistant?
"I admire Gates, in all honesty. He built this platform, he marketed it, he made it by hard work. Admittedly, he did not do it all." That's right - he didn't do it all . . . he "borrowed" it from Apple, Xerox, and those guys that he paid $50,000 for DOS! That's my opinion and I'm stickin' to it! SteveComment
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Where do you stand? Are you consistant?
Steve, When I was studying Computer Science at UCLA, I was part of the Engineering dept. The engineering students used to taunt us by saying, "yeah, engineers INVENT while programmers COPY." It wasn't until I had been in business for many years that I finally realized that hardly anybody in the world invents, almost everything we use in our world was a better copy of something somebody did earlier. Certainly, there's nothing wrong with improving upon another's idea. Even if the improvement only amounts to better marketing. chuck Opinions expressed are not necessarily those of my employer. "Steve McKay"Comment
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Where do you stand? Are you consistant?
Chuck - If you're "copying" and don't pretend to be "creating", fine. If you're "copying" and claiming the copy as an original idea, I've got a problem with that, especially when you use that claim as a basis for manipulating the inventor's business (Apple) or running the inventor out of business (pick a small software company). SteveComment
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Where do you stand? Are you consistant?
Steve,What did Apple invent that MS copied? Certainly it wasn't the GUI or the mouse or anything related to the Macintosh. It's clearly documented that Steve Jobs stole those ideas from Xerox's PARC.I don't know of many things that Microsoft has claimed to invent. They don't claim to have invented DOS, they don't claim to have invented GUI, they don't claim to have invented compression, they don't claim to have invented a browser. What items are you talking about?When it comes to running the inventor out of business, that happens in most segments of our free enterprise system. In general, (and this is a generality with a few exceptions), it's the best _marketer_ not the bestinventor that succeeds. Also, in general, most inventors are terrible marketers.And, in the final analysis, it's often the greed of the inventor that does them in. The get an idea, it becomes somewhat popular, they get offers to sell and that's what they do. Sometimes the company they sell their invention to will quietly quash the invention. So, while it appears that the big guy ran the inventor out of business, the inventor got what they wanted: money. Are we better, as consumers, when this happens?Maybe not, but that's the way it is.chuckOpinions expressed are not necessarily those of my employer."Steve McKay" <Steve_McKay@forums.midrangecomputing.com> wrote in message news:1e53b24e.8@WebX.WawyahGHajS...Chuck - If you're "copying" and don't pretend to be "creating", fine. If you're "copying" and claiming the copy as an original idea, I've got a problem with that, especially when you use that claim as a basis for manipulating the inventor's business (Apple) or running the inventor out of business (pick a small software company). SteveComment
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Where do you stand? Are you consistant?
"I don't know of many things that Microsoft has claimed to invent." Chuck - I don't know of many things that Microsoft has invented, period. They prefer to "innovate" by spending money to drive any perceived threat out of business. I would be more comfortable sending money to Redmond if I thought it would be spent to invent rather than intimidate or monopolize (oops, there's that word!). SteveComment
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Where do you stand? Are you consistant?
I'm pretty sure that Microsoft invented PowerPoint, a pretty good little program. Just about everything else has been acquired. The means of acquisition has been of differing ethical degrees, and of course depends on the viewpoint of the observer. JoeComment
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Where do you stand? Are you consistant?
Funny, over the years I've seen a lot of rhetoric in the AS/400 forums against Microsoft. Most notably, those MS haters (you can tell them at a glance because they use M$ instead of MS), will argue that the MS monopoly must end. Microsoft, they'll say, puts so much into their operating system that they put the little guys out of business. Companies like Stac were hurt when they put compression in. Netscape was damaged when Explorer was included. Now Windows XP will include even more products that can potentially hurt the competition. Ok, you guys know who you are, you've complained loud and hard. (Mostly, I believe, you hated MS simply because you didn't like Bill Gates.) Now, we'll see whether your convictions were based upon moral ground or purely anti-Microsoft/anti-Bill Gates. Why will we see that? Because IBM's V5R1 includes a lot of tools that could damage the little guys. Many third party players will have the need for their tools eliminated. According to Midrange Computing, this release will step on the toes of other companies products such as ASC's management tools. I've always said that I want more in my OS, whether it be Windows or OS/400. I've never agreed that the OS manufacturer should be limited to what they should include. How about you? If you were a loud complainer about MS, er M$, in the past, now is the time to start complaining about IBM. Or, is it your belief that IBM shouldn't be held to the same standard? chuck Opinions expressed are not necessarily those of my employer.Comment
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Where do you stand? Are you consistant?
And, in the final analysis, it's often the greed of the inventor that does them in. The get an idea, it becomes somewhat popular, they get offers to sell and that's what they do. Sometimes the company they sell their invention to will quietly quash the invention.
Good point. It's not just greed BTW (whatever that means in the context of a market economy) but an accepted strategy to grow a company to a certain size and sell it on. In the extremely unlikely event that I ever found myself in a similar position to the young Bill Gates I'm pretty certain that my nerve would go once I'd got the company into the low millions. I'd simply sell out and live comfortably on the proceeds. There's no way in a zillion years that I could ever do what he's done. Dave...Comment
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